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 Post subject: Ward Churchill
PostPosted: Thu 02-10-2005 9:17AM 
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Can anyone find this pig's actual comments?

EDIT: It appears that this is it: http://www.walterindenver.com/archives/001053.html -- WRONG

here: http://www.kersplebedeb.com/mystuff/s11/churchill.html


Last edited by jthxv on Thu 02-10-2005 12:03PM, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu 02-10-2005 11:57AM 
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http://www.kersplebedeb.com/mystuff/s11/churchill.html

Hey, try reading things before you name call. Also, please note that in the book upon which this essay was expanded, the wording is quite different and he documents just about everything he states. If you want text of the essay from the book just ask, I can post it directly.

[EDIT] link to book http://www.akpress.org/2003/items/onthe ... ngchickens if anyone is all that interested, I happen to have a copy.

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PostPosted: Thu 02-10-2005 12:04PM 
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I heard enough quotes (one would have done it) to know this piece of trash isn't worth a shit.


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PostPosted: Thu 02-10-2005 12:11PM 
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This fucker is so full of shit, he can't even get his own history right:
http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/l ... 79,00.html


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PostPosted: Thu 02-10-2005 12:14PM 
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ward_Churchill
There is stuff about his history there. From what I have deciphered, he is definitely of Native American decent, just he didn't grow up in a tribe.

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PostPosted: Thu 02-10-2005 12:15PM 
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jthxv wrote:
I heard enough quotes (one would have done it) to know this piece of trash isn't worth a shit.


Hmmm... Inflamitory hate speach?
Oh well, just try and realize quotes taken out of context are meaningless. You must understand the entire work before a quote from it has meaning.

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I prefer a less bleak outlook on the world!

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PostPosted: Thu 02-10-2005 12:20PM 
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Quote:
Ward Churchill (born 1948) is an activist who claims to be of mixed white and Native American heritage.


Quote:
In early February of 2005, the Keetoowah Band Cherokee publicly announced that Churchill was not actually a member of their tribe, as he had claimed.


Quote:
Several other Indian groups have opined that Churchill is a fraud.


From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ward_Churchill


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PostPosted: Thu 02-10-2005 12:21PM 
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Chuchill 'On the Justice of Roosting Chickens' p. 19 wrote:
The implications of this were set forth in stark relief during the aftermath of 9-l-l, when it was first suggested that a decided majority of those killed in the WTC attack might be more accurately viewed as "little Eichmanns"--that is, as a cadre of faceless bureaucrats and technical experts who had willingly (and profitably) harnessed themselves to the task making America's genocidal world order hum with maximal efficiency--than as "innocents."126 The storm of outraged exception taken by self-proclaimed progressives to this simple observation has been instructive, to say the least. The objections have been mostly transparent in their diversionary intent, seeking as they have to focus attention exclusively on janitors, firemen and food service workers rather than the much larger number of corporate managers, stock brokers, bond traders, finance and systems analysts, etc., among those killed. 127

A few have complained of the "cold-bloodedness" and "insensitivity" embodied, not in the vocations pursued by the latter group, but in describing their attitudes/conduct as having been in any way analogous to Eichmann's. Left unstated, however, is the more accurate term we should employ in characterizing a representative 30-year old foreign exchange trader who, in full knowledge that every cent of his lavish commissions derived from the starving flesh of defenseless Others, literally wallowed in self-indulgent excess, playing the big shot, priding himself on being "a sharp dresser" and the fact that "money spilled from his pockets...flowed like crazy...[spent] on the black BMW and those clothes--forgetting to pack ski clothes for a Lake Tahoe trip, dropping $1,000 on new stuff," and so on.128 As a "cool guy" with a "warm heart"? A "good family man"? Just an "ordinary," "average" or "normal" fellow who "happened to strike it riCh"?129 HOW then are we to describe Eichmann himself?130

Clearly, either the devastating insights concerning "the banality of evil" offered by Hannah Arendt in her1963 study, Eichmann in Jerusalem, have yet to penetrate the consciousness of many American progressives,131 or American progressives are in the main every bit as mired in the depths of denial as the most hidebound of their conservative counterparts.132 Irrespective of whether there is an appreciable segment of the U.S. population prepared to look the matter in the face, however, the same condition of willful blindness cannot be said to prevail throughout much of the rest of the World.133

Excusing one's self for one's crimes is never a legitimate prerogative, nor are attempts to hide or explain them away. This is all the more true while the crimes are being repeated. Neither justice, forgiveness nor exegesis can be self-administered or bestowed. Of this, there should be no doubt in a country where the principle of "victims' rights" has lately been enshrined as an article of juridical faith.134 Those who comprised the "chickens" of 9-l-l will have their say, and it will ultimately be definitive. In this connection, the only real question confronting the U.S. polity is how in the future it will be necessary for them to say it. And that, rightly enough, will be entirely contingent upon the extent and decisiveness with which Americans prove capable of factoring such voices into the calculus of their personal and national self-concepts.

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PostPosted: Thu 02-10-2005 12:38PM 
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jthxv wrote:
Quote:
Ward Churchill (born 1948) is an activist who claims to be of mixed white and Native American heritage.


Quote:
In early February of 2005, the Keetoowah Band Cherokee publicly announced that Churchill was not actually a member of their tribe, as he had claimed.


Quote:
Several other Indian groups have opined that Churchill is a fraud.


From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ward_Churchill


Of all the criticism about his background, this is the source of it. I don't know about you, but that doesn't look very credible, does it?
Image
http://www.aimovement.org/csi/Churchill ... ill_01.jpg

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"I always find it hard to believe that there are people out there that think every problem can be solved without violence." --moo
I prefer a less bleak outlook on the world!

The vinyl's still kickin' on my turntable tonight!
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PostPosted: Thu 02-10-2005 12:43PM 
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That is the article that YOU posted a link to in the first place. I just took some info out of it.


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PostPosted: Thu 02-10-2005 12:46PM 
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After looking at that same site myself, and seeing that the biography portion that you got that from was "very incomplete", I looked down and read the rest of it and saw
Quote:
Ernestine Berry, who was "on the tribe's enrollment committee and served on the tribal council for four years": "He was trying to get recognized as an Indian. He could not prove he was an Indian (Cherokee) at all." [7] (http://www.denverpost.com/Stories/0,141 ... 34,00.html) It is not unusual for Americans of mixed blood, especially those descended from Native Americans of different tribes to have difficulty definitively establishing their Native American heritage. Family traditions may be accurate, but are sometimes difficult to document.


So what exactly are you against this guy for? Because he says stuff like
Churchill wrote:
I am not a "defender" of the September 11 attacks, but simply pointing out that if U.S. foreign policy results in massive death and destruction abroad, we cannot feign innocence when some of that destruction is returned. I have never said that people "should" engage in armed attacks on the United States, but that such attacks are a natural and unavoidable consequence of unlawful U.S. policy. As Martin Luther King, quoting Robert F. Kennedy, said, "Those who make peaceful change impossible make violent change inevitable."

Just trying to get a handle on your view.

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PostPosted: Thu 02-10-2005 12:49PM 
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jthxv wrote:
That is the article that YOU posted a link to in the first place. I just took some info out of it.


The thing about these tribes now is that they are not really tribes in a sense that not belonging to one does not make one not of Native American decent. These tribes are more like clubs that one can join. Being a member or not means nothing. Also, as Churchill is not currently a memeber he was previously, as admitted by the AIM.

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I prefer a less bleak outlook on the world!

The vinyl's still kickin' on my turntable tonight!
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PostPosted: Thu 02-10-2005 12:51PM 
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More because he says shit like this:
Quote:
Well, really. Let's get a grip here, shall we? True enough, they were civilians of a sort. But innocent? Gimme a break. They formed a technocratic corps at the very heart of America's global financial empire – the "mighty engine of profit" to which the military dimension of U.S. policy has always been enslaved – and they did so both willingly and knowingly. Recourse to "ignorance" – a derivative, after all, of the word "ignore" – counts as less than an excuse among this relatively well-educated elite. To the extent that any of them were unaware of the costs and consequences to others of what they were involved in – and in many cases excelling at – it was because of their absolute refusal to see. More likely, it was because they were too busy braying, incessantly and self-importantly, into their cell phones, arranging power lunches and stock transactions, each of which translated, conveniently out of sight, mind and smelling distance, into the starved and rotting flesh of infants. If there was a better, more effective, or in fact any other way of visiting some penalty befitting their participation upon the little Eichmanns inhabiting the sterile sanctuary of the twin towers, I'd really be interested in hearing about it.


That quote you have was after the shit storm


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PostPosted: Thu 02-10-2005 1:29PM 
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jthxv wrote:
More because he says shit like this:
Quote:
Well, really. Let's get a grip here, shall we? True enough, they were civilians of a sort. But innocent? Gimme a break. They formed a technocratic corps at the very heart of America's global financial empire – the "mighty engine of profit" to which the military dimension of U.S. policy has always been enslaved – and they did so both willingly and knowingly. Recourse to "ignorance" – a derivative, after all, of the word "ignore" – counts as less than an excuse among this relatively well-educated elite. To the extent that any of them were unaware of the costs and consequences to others of what they were involved in – and in many cases excelling at – it was because of their absolute refusal to see. More likely, it was because they were too busy braying, incessantly and self-importantly, into their cell phones, arranging power lunches and stock transactions, each of which translated, conveniently out of sight, mind and smelling distance, into the starved and rotting flesh of infants. If there was a better, more effective, or in fact any other way of visiting some penalty befitting their participation upon the little Eichmanns inhabiting the sterile sanctuary of the twin towers, I'd really be interested in hearing about it.



So I take it you disagree. What's your counterpoint? Or maybe you just don't like the mean words? Boo-hoo.

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PostPosted: Thu 02-10-2005 1:37PM 
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Wow, so people are evil if they strive to excel in the business world? People deserve to die because they make alot of money? I feel sorry for the people who read this and find nothing wrong with it.

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